Nov 5, 2025 2 min read

Beyond the Noise: Two Conversations Worth Your Attention

This image was taken at a rally in New York City — a reminder of the climate of fear and hatred that too often frames our public discourse. (Source)

In the midst of the avalanche of anti-Muslim hatred and rhetoric currently surfacing around the New York City mayoral election, I just happened to come across two videos today that offered a reflective (and hopeful) pause from today’s insanity. Rather than furthering division or panic, these interviews are both thoughtful and challenging — each in their own way.

The first video that I saw (above) was an interview with famed Catholic writer and commentator on The Deen Show. I have known E. Michael Jones for a very long time, and I was even invited to work with him as a priest in 2020. I was shocked to see him on The Deen Show, as I know that Dr. Jones has been vocally critical — and sometimes very much so — of Islam in the past. And to be honest, I would never have thought that he would be on a ‘dawah’ sort of show like The Deen Show. But here it was! And what I heard was a thoughtful and mutually respectful discussion about what Muslims and Catholics share in common.

The next video I saw (also above) I enjoyed immensely. It was a discussion on The Thinking Muslim podcast with a Protestant pastor, Rev. Robert Owen Smith. In this hour and 14-minute long discussion, Rev. Smith goes over the history of Christian Zionism, his relationship with Muslims and Palestinians, and the tragic impact that Christian Zionism has on communities, politics, and our global order. It is a very thoughtful and measured discussion, and well worth anybody’s time.

What truly stands out when you listen to both Dr. E. Michael Jones and Rev. Smith is how real interaction with Muslim individuals and the Muslim community made a deep and profound change in their ways of viewing Muslims and Islam in general. Both of them stress the warmth and overwhelming hospitality that they encountered among Muslim individuals, and this especially comes through in Dr. Jones’ account of travelling within the Middle East and the Muslim world — especially Iran and Egypt — for the very first time and being totally blown over at the warmth, love, and hospitality that he felt. It was something that he’s never experienced anywhere else before, and this alone played a huge part in overcoming his learned anti-Muslim hatred and hostility and seeing Islam in a new light.

You may not agree with everything said in these interviews, but they are well worth a watch and a thoughtful engagement. I think that these sorts of discussions will go a long way in healing some of the unnecessary animosities and divisions between two peoples of faith —Christians and Muslims. These are animosities that, I suspect, certain powers are all too eager to keep alive for their own cynical ends.

May God help us, and my He continue to guide us upon the Right Path.

*“We must meet the other not as an enemy, but as a revelation.”*— **Martin Buber**

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Thank you, and may God reward you! Glory to God for all things!